Cross-Training, strength training, & misc questions...

[chaosdsm]

First a little background on me:
I've been inline skating for about 6 years now. Started with a cheap pair of Rollerblade skates, then moved up to a better pair of K2's, then back to Rollerblade Lightning 10's, & finally purchased a pair of full custom Bont Vaypor 3 point speed skates. I purchased the Bont's because: A> I am moving towards speed skating more & more. B> I have a very wide foot so full custom was the best way to get a skate to fit my foot. BTW... my foot measures 273mm long & 278mm circumfrence at the ball of the foot, & my dress shoe size is 9 1/2 4E US Mens.

Anyway, I've never had any formal training, coaching, or instruction. I basicly put my first pair of skates on & started skating. Skating through all kinds of aches, pains, bad habits, etc... There are certified instructors within an hour drive but my work schedule (nights) makes it nearly impossible to meet up with one.

I'm currently skating between 75 & 150 miles a week (3 - 5 days a week, 25-30 miles/day) & recently finished the Disney Inline full marathon in 2hrs 6min 21sec

So my first question is this:
Would Ice skating lessons be a good way of learning better habits & form for inline skating??? There is a rink that I can go for lessons at a time & price that would work for me. The beginning lessons are 8 weeks, 1hr per week & is cheaper than Eddy Matzger's skate farm, not even counting the travel to VA. Although, eventually, I'd like to do one of the 5 day Skate Farm's, like maybe late summer/ early fall of '08.

2nd question:
Besides cycling, what are some good cross-training options?

3rd question:
Are there any specific free-weight exercises I should do to help improve my skating, & lower back strength?


TIA.

[chaosdsm]

Surely someone has on opinion...

I definitely need some help, cause my overall speed sucks, & I seem to do better long distance than short distance. For example, at Disney, the first 6 miles was 25min 53sec (according to my GPS), while Sunday (4/22/07), I skated a 10K at 27min 8sec... Based on Disney, I felt as though I should have done a sub 25min 10K.

[Robert]

Sorry I didn't notice your post earlier.

Yes, ice skating is great training for inline skating. In fact, Eddy Matzger trained on the ice with Olympic coach Diane Holum (sp?). The tricky part about inline skating is (aside from balance) learning to push to the side. And of course, it's the same on the ice. ... So yes, do that. But to try to take some inline lessons, as well. We need to provide some work for those inline instructors.

As for cross training, aside from cycling, running is great (even if it's not so much fun.)

... Maybe someone else can chime in on weight training. I don't have much experience there.

[NYCSKATER]

Surely someone has on opinion...

I definitely need some help, cause my overall speed sucks, & I seem to do better long distance than short distance. For example, at Disney, the first 6 miles was 25min 53sec (according to my GPS), while Sunday (4/22/07), I skated a 10K at 27min 8sec... Based on Disney, I felt as though I should have done a sub 25min 10K.

PERHAPS it might be helpful to take a look at SPEED ON SKATES, by Barry Publow. It is an outstanding book. Described by experienced skaters as the ultimate resource on inline technique and training. It also has a chapter on ice and related tradeoffs. Given how committed to skating you seem to be I would bet you'll love the book. It is a truly outstanding resource. You may find yourself going back to it over time as your technique improves. One final suggestion. I would suggest that you focus on one technical improvement at the time so that you can best isolate cause and effect. The book is a bit dated. However, its principles and insights remain essential. The book is a systematic review of the basic skating principles and their applications to both inline and ice. You can find it at amazon for about $15. Glad to try to answer specific questions. Good luck!

[Jim White]

The best way to learn to skate inline, and to build your body to skate inline, is to skate inline. Also, if you are doing a 2 hour marathon, you are probably beyond whatever inline a beginning ice class would give you.

Working nights doesn't keep someone from working with an instructor; most of them can train days and weekends (or am I missing something). But if you are doing a 2 hour marathon, and want to improve distance speed, some instructors may not be able to help you much, so best if you would also work with experienced speed coaches or skaters. There are plenty in Florida, and there cost rarely is a problem.

[The Major]

Many people neglect getting themselves into the best possible condition, regardless of sport. Get into a sports conditioning program. I think many begining skaters lack general fitness. Before you can become a better, faster skater you have to improve your overall strength and conditioning. If there's a Boot Camp program in your area, give it a try.

[chaosdsm]

The best way to learn to skate inline, and to build your body to skate inline, is to skate inline. Also, if you are doing a 2 hour marathon, you are probably beyond whatever inline a beginning ice class would give you.

Working nights doesn't keep someone from working with an instructor; most of them can train days and weekends (or am I missing something). But if you are doing a 2 hour marathon, and want to improve distance speed, some instructors may not be able to help you much, so best if you would also work with experienced speed coaches or skaters. There are plenty in Florida, and there cost rarely is a problem.

I don't know, ice skating has a lot to do with edge control which is also important in inline skating.

I need to work on technique & correct form more so than speed & distance, & I'm sure that technique & form can only help with speed... Distance is no big deal, I've only once skated further than my feet/ankles could handle (40 miles), although the rest of me was ready to go several more miles...

I only know of 1 certified instructor in the area, is there a site or easy way to find others? Also, because I work week nights, my week days aren't very good for me to travel 1hr + to see an instructor & return in time for work... as it is, just skating local I'm still cutting it close to being late for work. Weekends are even more messed up unless I want to get up on Sat after 4hrs of sleep then travel to an instructor, & Sunday's I'm usually working on the house. Just not enough hours in a day for me to do everything I want/need to do.

I've added a couple of things to my training already that are helping a little bit. I'll check localy for that BP book tomorrow before ordering it online.

Thanks for the info everyone!

[Jim White]

Here's a list of instructors, or at least most of those who are certified:
http://www.unitedskateschools.org/Membe ... ctory.html

Also, there's a Yahoo email group of Inline_Instruction which is intended for instructors talking to each other. If you sent good question(s), they'd probably be posted.

Some very good skaters train in Kissimmee. But they are also intense; skating is the most important thing is some of their lives, more so than sleeping. Anyone passionate about skating is welcome, but someone who isn't wouldn't be comfortable. http://www.teamflorida.org/schedule.htm

True, ice skating has a lot to do with edge control, and with many other things which are the same or similar to inline. The way you control your edges on ice is similar to, but not the same as on inlines. Perhaps your situation/priorities are such that good inline training is unrealistic for you; if so, then ice is surely better than nothing.

Agree that technique and form will help speed

[sxevegan]

I think that skating is a better form of crosstraining to cycling and running than cycling and running is to skating.

Cycling and running are both great for building aerobic fitness. The problem is, they won't directly help your technique. Speed is all about technique. I don't care how in-shape a person is, if their technique sucks they won't go fast.

I agree that beginner lessons probably aren't for you. I think you're past that already. I'm sure you know what good skating looks like. Find a person with good form and try and mimmick it behind them. Step with them. Keep your shoulders in line with theirs. Make sure your knees are bent as low as theirs are (or even lower!).

Good luck! Let us know how things are going and feel free to ask questions.

[policedutchdog]

I agree with the Major's recommendations. Strength, conditioning/core and a plyometrics program will help more than going out and skating or running a ton of miles.

When I came back to the sport a year ago after a 10 year lay-off, I was skating 4-5 days a week and was seeing very little improvment in speed. It wasn't until I started spending time in the gym to gain strength and working a plyometrics program that real improvment was made.

Now I only skate 2 days a week with a group of skaters, 3 days week lifting and 2-3 days of plyometrics, intervals, stationary bike or road biking. My speed has incresed to the point that I can run a sub 1:20 marathon and I can keep my form together throughout the entire race.

Scott

[The Major]

I agree with Rob about form, but if you don't have a certain level of conditioning, it's hard to train hard enough to increase speed. To really up your level a combination of good form, good conditioning, a lot's of interval training on your skates.

[chaosdsm]

When I came back to the sport a year ago after a 10 year lay-off, I was skating 4-5 days a week and was seeing very little improvment in speed.

Scott

Funny you should mention that... that's exactly how I feel which is one of the reasons I'm inquiring about cross-training & what not.

Back when I was only skating 1 day a week as a recreational skater, my progress was much better, but part of that may be because I wasn't skating alone as I am now. I went from skating about 8-9MPH for 10-12 miles to skating about 13.5MPH for 15-17 miles in about 16 months. Then I had to quit for a about a year & a half due to family emergency. After starting back I started out at about 9MPH average but in the 14 months since starting again, I've only managed to get up to about 11MPH average, but at least I'm skating 25-40 miles a day which is really helping me loose weight!

This is only in regards to training BTW, when it comes to races like Disney & my recent 10K I've managed to do a little bit better, averaging 13.7MPH for the 10K.